Perfecting off-lead recall

kirama · 05-02-2010, 09:47 AM

I have a trainer friend who takes Beck & Murphy out for a few hours a week to run and play with other dogs, all the dogs are off lead - she usually has between 5 and 9 dogs with her. I had asked her for her help with Beck several months ago when he turned one year old and suddenly went 'deaf' when I would call him off-lead. She suggested that I let her take him out with some other dogs to work on this and I'm happy to report that his long recalls have improved 100%.

I asked her how she did it and she said that initially, she calls the dogs back to her before they go off too far and always has something for them that makes it worth their while to return. It might be a mud puddle to splash in, or a treat, or a bowl of cold water- but it's always something... When they realize that there's something terrific to return to, they never hesitate. Once they are 100% reliable she waits until they are further away to call them to her. She said Beck returns to her now at any distance where he can hear her voice!

So, it is possible to achieve perfect recall, and it can be done without any kind of devices or coercion - just base it on the good ole premise that what ever you have for the dog is more important than what he's doing while he's away from you! She said that having more than one dog with you helps because of a dog's natural inclination to beat other dogs to a valuable resource, and also- she always starts off with one of her dogs that has perfect recall so that the other dogs will follow her until they learn it on their own.

KingstonTodd · 05-02-2010, 10:32 AM

It is nice to have perfect recall. Congrats, and good boy Beck. It is such a piece of mind to trust your dogs like that. I had two doods off leash yesterday and Aero deided to try and catch birds and ran very far away chasing a low flying robin. I brought her there for this reason, to burn off some full speed steam. I tested her a few times. She was at least 100 yards away, at full speed running away. I wistled, AERO COME, she spun on a dime and raced at full speed back to me. She in under 7 months and there was a major distraction. We are so proud of her. We teach all our dogs recall with +R only starting in the house with a huge reward, a full bowl of food, and slowly reduce the reward to a few kibbles then to a belly rub, while we increase the distance and distraction. We trained Hershey and Gus the same way and they are also just as reliable. The best advice I can give when learning is to never give the command if you cant enforce it if they dog doesnt listen (hence start in the house, or with long lead), and only give thes command once. They have better hearig than you can imagine and repeating just teaches them they can choose to ignore you if they want.

Jac · 05-02-2010, 03:10 PM

I absolutely agree with this...it is an excellent method!
One question, though, there are dogs, (I have one) the bolt the second they are free...and nothing I offer will bring them back, so...how do you begin training this type of dog when you can't trust them to stay within a safe distance? I understand the theory of beginning in the house, and even in the fenced yard (we have a huge fenced area that I can work with) but my dogs are smart enough to know that they are free when they are not in these confined places and they will bolt.
So since you don't want to risk giving the command and having them not obey and since you don't want them to run off, what do you do? I know that I can start with a 50' lead, or even a 100' lead...but how can you be sure that once they ARE free, that they will obey?
Honestly, if my dogs are not in the encolsed area, I am afraid to remove the lead...

kirama · 05-02-2010, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jac

I absolutely agree with this...it is an excellent method!
One question, though, there are dogs, (I have one) the bolt the second they are free...and nothing I offer will bring them back, so...how do you begin training this type of dog when you can't trust them to stay within a safe distance? I understand the theory of beginning in the house, and even in the fenced yard (we have a huge fenced area that I can work with) but my dogs are smart enough to know that they are free when they are not in these confined places and they will bolt.
So since you don't want to risk giving the command and having them not obey and since you don't want them to run off, what do you do? I know that I can start with a 50' lead, or even a 100' lead...but how can you be sure that once they ARE free, that they will obey?
Honestly, if my dogs are not in the encolsed area, I am afraid to remove the lead...

I don't have a great answer for you, I was scared too when Beck started ignoring me that he would just bolt and I would never find him. That's why I asked my friend & she offered to work with him.

KingstonTodd · 05-02-2010, 07:48 PM

I have never dealt with a "bolter" so maybe I am lucky or have always cought them at the right age to learn come before they learned defiance. I must have done 100 succesfull tests in a row over a coule of weeks in a fenced yard with Aero before I trusted her off leash in a park. Then I also had her in a pack with the other two who were already trained, so if she didnt listen to me she would follow them. It was very soon that she was the leader of the recall pack. I really think starting the day with a recall for their first meal is good to cement things. If a bolter is not food oriented, I am not sure what to do.

Jac · 05-02-2010, 10:03 PM

Thanks...Bayley is just so smart and independent that she knows when she is free...and she will look over her soulder as if to say, "Sorry mom, but I have to do this!" Then the others follow her! We just don't trust them...so that is why we have 8 acres...and keep them on leash at other times. Still, I wish we could trust her...some of our dogs are great to say put. They get outside and think, "hmmm, food (at home), no food. food, no food. food." and they come right back.

Remy · 05-03-2010, 02:51 PM

Remy is now 17 months old and was pretty good at coming back to me at the park..... that is if there were no geese to chase

then she would run way off and completely ignore me. So I recently bought a silent dog whistle (made by acme) and started by using around the house and when she came to me rewarding her with a treat. Then later using it at the park. I like the idea of a whistle as I understand that a dog who is trained to a whistle can hear it up to 2 miles away depending on wind. Also it makes your recall command more consistent... ie A "COME Remy" if I am anxious that she is in danger is different to a "Come Remy" with out any worries around. It also takes out all the inconsistency of whether I am blowing it or my daughter or my husband - it always sounds the same. I have to say the biggest thing that I have learnt about dog training thus far is consistency is the key.

Jac · 05-03-2010, 07:24 PM

That is a great idea! Thanks for posting!

05-02-2010, 09:47 AM	#1 (permalink)
kirama Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 858	Perfecting off-lead recall I have a trainer friend who takes Beck & Murphy out for a few hours a week to run and play with other dogs, all the dogs are off lead - she usually has between 5 and 9 dogs with her. I had asked her for her help with Beck several months ago when he turned one year old and suddenly went 'deaf' when I would call him off-lead. She suggested that I let her take him out with some other dogs to work on this and I'm happy to report that his long recalls have improved 100%. I asked her how she did it and she said that initially, she calls the dogs back to her before they go off too far and always has something for them that makes it worth their while to return. It might be a mud puddle to splash in, or a treat, or a bowl of cold water- but it's always something... When they realize that there's something terrific to return to, they never hesitate. Once they are 100% reliable she waits until they are further away to call them to her. She said Beck returns to her now at any distance where he can hear her voice! So, it is possible to achieve perfect recall, and it can be done without any kind of devices or coercion - just base it on the good ole premise that what ever you have for the dog is more important than what he's doing while he's away from you! She said that having more than one dog with you helps because of a dog's natural inclination to beat other dogs to a valuable resource, and also- she always starts off with one of her dogs that has perfect recall so that the other dogs will follow her until they learn it on their own. __________________

05-02-2010, 10:32 AM	#2 (permalink)
KingstonTodd Super Moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 2,005	Re: Perfecting off-lead recall It is nice to have perfect recall. Congrats, and good boy Beck. It is such a piece of mind to trust your dogs like that. I had two doods off leash yesterday and Aero deided to try and catch birds and ran very far away chasing a low flying robin. I brought her there for this reason, to burn off some full speed steam. I tested her a few times. She was at least 100 yards away, at full speed running away. I wistled, AERO COME, she spun on a dime and raced at full speed back to me. She in under 7 months and there was a major distraction. We are so proud of her. We teach all our dogs recall with +R only starting in the house with a huge reward, a full bowl of food, and slowly reduce the reward to a few kibbles then to a belly rub, while we increase the distance and distraction. We trained Hershey and Gus the same way and they are also just as reliable. The best advice I can give when learning is to never give the command if you cant enforce it if they dog doesnt listen (hence start in the house, or with long lead), and only give thes command once. They have better hearig than you can imagine and repeating just teaches them they can choose to ignore you if they want.

05-02-2010, 03:10 PM	#3 (permalink)
Jac Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: northern California Posts: 9,243	Re: Perfecting off-lead recall I absolutely agree with this...it is an excellent method! One question, though, there are dogs, (I have one) the bolt the second they are free...and nothing I offer will bring them back, so...how do you begin training this type of dog when you can't trust them to stay within a safe distance? I understand the theory of beginning in the house, and even in the fenced yard (we have a huge fenced area that I can work with) but my dogs are smart enough to know that they are free when they are not in these confined places and they will bolt. So since you don't want to risk giving the command and having them not obey and since you don't want them to run off, what do you do? I know that I can start with a 50' lead, or even a 100' lead...but how can you be sure that once they ARE free, that they will obey? Honestly, if my dogs are not in the encolsed area, I am afraid to remove the lead...

05-02-2010, 07:48 PM	#5 (permalink)
KingstonTodd Super Moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 2,005	Re: Perfecting off-lead recall I have never dealt with a "bolter" so maybe I am lucky or have always cought them at the right age to learn come before they learned defiance. I must have done 100 succesfull tests in a row over a coule of weeks in a fenced yard with Aero before I trusted her off leash in a park. Then I also had her in a pack with the other two who were already trained, so if she didnt listen to me she would follow them. It was very soon that she was the leader of the recall pack. I really think starting the day with a recall for their first meal is good to cement things. If a bolter is not food oriented, I am not sure what to do.

05-02-2010, 10:03 PM	#6 (permalink)
Jac Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: northern California Posts: 9,243	Re: Perfecting off-lead recall Thanks...Bayley is just so smart and independent that she knows when she is free...and she will look over her soulder as if to say, "Sorry mom, but I have to do this!" Then the others follow her! We just don't trust them...so that is why we have 8 acres...and keep them on leash at other times. Still, I wish we could trust her...some of our dogs are great to say put. They get outside and think, "hmmm, food (at home), no food. food, no food. food." and they come right back.

05-03-2010, 02:51 PM	#7 (permalink)
Remy Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 46	Re: Perfecting off-lead recall Remy is now 17 months old and was pretty good at coming back to me at the park..... that is if there were no geese to chase then she would run way off and completely ignore me. So I recently bought a silent dog whistle (made by acme) and started by using around the house and when she came to me rewarding her with a treat. Then later using it at the park. I like the idea of a whistle as I understand that a dog who is trained to a whistle can hear it up to 2 miles away depending on wind. Also it makes your recall command more consistent... ie A "COME Remy" if I am anxious that she is in danger is different to a "Come Remy" with out any worries around. It also takes out all the inconsistency of whether I am blowing it or my daughter or my husband - it always sounds the same. I have to say the biggest thing that I have learnt about dog training thus far is consistency is the key.

05-03-2010, 07:24 PM	#8 (permalink)
Jac Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: northern California Posts: 9,243	Re: Perfecting off-lead recall That is a great idea! Thanks for posting!

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