a question about warranties or terms

[Maureen]

hi all, I have a question that I've wondered about and if you don't mind I would like to hear from as many of you as possible, about your warranty or guarantee (is there a difference Jac? )

I'll go first:
My contract states that I will replace a puppy with a puppy if there is a genetic health defect, such as Hip Dysplaysia. That's a pretty standard offer, and thank God I've never had to follow thru. But with how people love their pets, and with knowing someone who gave their puppy not one but 2 hip surgeries (1 on each hip) I have wondered about this.

What would be the difference in refunding the $$ if the family doesn't want to surrender their pet? What if they wanted the cash to place it towards the surgery? (Or whatever the ailment)


Thanks in advance to any of you who will reply.

[holly]

We offer a 100% refund to go towards treatment - the owner is not required to return the puppy to receive the refund. However if they would like to return the puppy they can.

If you would like to see a copy of our guarantee just email me.

Holly
http://fourpawsdoodles.com

[Maureen]

thanks Holly!

[Jac]

Hi Maureen,
My contract says it is a warranty against "serious genetic disease" which is a very subjective term. (Warranty and Guarantee are, for all intents and purposes, the same thing...)
I will either replace the puppy, give a full refund or give a new puppy to them (and not get the other one back), it is their choice.
Basicilly, I want to work with my customers so that we get the best solution for them and for the puppy.
I have a lot more to add...so I will PM you!

[gracielou]

Hi Maureen, I like to just keep my customers happy I haven't at this time had this issue but I'm sure if we stay in the business long enough it may happen. I would never make a family return the puppy or dog unless they wanted to, and I would still honor any defect. That's just me keep the customers happy and you get referrals!!!

[wally]

Is it standard for reputable breeders to certify all breeding stock AND offer full refund towards a genetic HD in the future?

Why would a "reputable" breeder only offer 50% and no cert on one of the parents?

[Maureen]

I'm not sure I am following you, Wally....could you give more details for filling in the blanks on your question?
I don't think I know what you mean about certifying breeding stock.

[gracielou]

I agree your question is a little vague if you could be a little more specific perhaps one of us can help you.

[movistar]

Originally Posted by wally

Is it standard for reputable breeders to certify all breeding stock AND offer full refund towards a genetic HD in the future?

Why would a "reputable" breeder only offer 50% and no cert on one of the parents?

I think I may follow... one parent has not been certified for hips correct? and they only offer 50% refund for a gentic condition?

That doesnt sound good to me. Both parents should have ALL testing done. I would say a 100% refund would be in order if a serious genetic defect were to present itself.

I have my guarantee on my website at www.OurDoodRanch.com
It is a fairly common guarantee, please feel free to read it.

[wally]

Yes, that was it. We were just trying to put our priorities in line when choosing a breeder. And the topic of warranties came up. Beyond gender, size, color, location etc...etc...etc...

It seems hip testing and a full warranty against genetic health problems mostly will determine if a breeder is considered reputble. Including sale price refund.

We've had HD in our dogs in the past. Both shelter dogs. The main reason we are willing to spend major $ with a breeder and do major research, is we cannot afford to live through that again.

Why wouldnt all breeders test every parent and cover a full warranty if there are genetic issues that are either super slim, or could have been prevented?

They are making a living doing this right

[Jac]

Hi Wally,
I certainly appreciate the fact that you are doing research on this. It is when people, like you, do their research and carefully select a breeder that we stand a chance of eliminating puppy mills and back yard breeders.
In answer to your questions, I believe it is a moral responsibility that breeders have to their customers...but even more importantly, that they have to their puppies. My question would be, why would a breeder contribute to the possibility that one of these defenseless, loving creatures are born with a severe and debiliting deformity or disease? That seems absolutely heartless.
But, your question is why wouldn't every breeder do this testing and offer refunds...the answer is simple...they are either only in it for the money, or they don't have a clue about breeding...or both.
When you ask if people are making money from this, it is hard to believe (given the high fee charged for Labradoodles) but most of us are barely breaking even. For instance, for me to hip test (I use PennHip) it costs $360 for one dog. Add to that the fee to test (at the same time) elbows and patellas and you are looking at about $600 for one test. If that test comes back with bad numbers...a good breeder knows that they must spay/neuter the dog and find a good home for it. So, they have likely purchased the dog for anywhere between $3000 and $30,000 (Austrailian Multigen) and they have proven that breeding is not advisable...so now they add to the cost by spay or neuter and then they try to find the best home possible for the dog as someone's pet.
And you start over with another dog.
Some breeders don't want to know! You see, if they don't test, they can't know if they are breeding healthy dogs or not...so they just mark them down and sell them.
Other breeders test their dogs and find a slightly higher possibility of a problem...but they weigh the good qualities of the dog and decide to breed anyway. The difference is that this breeder recognizes that there is a chance that the some of the puppies could be born with a certain problem...and they offer a reasonable time frame (I offer 3 years) and a good warranty. They let the owner decide. They can either keep the puppy that they love and get their money back to apply to treatment. (My preference, because the puppy is in a loving home and that is what is most important.) Or they can return the puppy in exchange for another puppy.
What it boils down to is the same in this business as in all businesses, people are either honorable or they are not. Only in this business not only customers end up on the losing end, but puppies suffer and die.
It takes a very caring and honorable person to be a reputable breeder. That's why you find that not all breeders are reputable.
Sad, but true.
Still, when people like you put the pressure on and refuse to buy from these breeders, they will stop making money and decide that it isn't a good business for them. Maybe you are saving lives. I hope so! Congratulations to you for caring.

[wally]

Thank you so much for the well thought out response. I agree with everything you said. Being that we recently lost both our dogs to old age, but both lived with a horrible cases of HD, we are searching for the right breeder to help prevent some of these worries.

You certainly seem to be an asset to not only this forum but also reputable breeders who will do the right things...every time!

Hats off to you!

[Jac]

Thanks, Wally, I try...sure do love these dogs!

[M&Tdoodles]

Our warranty is for three years for hips, and two years for health. It is available on our website now (finally). It refunds the owner up to the cost of the puppy to cover medical treatment. We feel a replacement puppy would be difficult, since 1,, we are a small breeder and 2, once a puppy or adult has been in the home for 3 years the likely hood of someone wanting to return her/him is not high. ALL WE ARE CONCERNED about is the health of our puppy. We do say OUR because they are all ours, forever! We care for them at age 3 as we did for them at birth and will forever. We also offer a refundable deposit. If something comes up, illness, family problem etc we would rather return the deposit then have someone adopt the pup in fear of loosing their deposit and then have a problem in caring for the puppy. We may not be legal eagles but we are in it for the breed and the happiness of both the puppies and their new adoptive parents

[Doodlesville]

OK maybe i need to rework my guarantee, (havent done it in about 2yrs)
would you all mind sending me copies of your contract, and allowing me to use them as a guide line?

thanks bunches Nancy
send to nan@doodlesville.com if you would please,
,thanks so very much for any assistance you can provide,
hope everyone is well